Proposal 7: Creation of the Security Council

[Nero Superbus]

I want to propose a new thing. Seeing the spamming members and counter-revolutionary ones emerge, i want to create a new institution within the Internationale.

Basically i want to create the Security Council, an institution responsible with justice within the Internationale (moderation, punishing for damaging the Internationale and solving problems among the members). In this institution (which will have a forum), any member could report anyone or any institution of the Internationale and we will take care of the trial and eventual punishment (exclusion from the Internationale, democratic referendum for reform, suspending for a number of days, gold payment).

This way, not only that members damaging the Internationale would be excluded fast, but we could ensure the solve of many, many disputes in this organization (like those with Mannimarco and other members that have disputes with their comrades).

I want to add the following lines to the Constitution:

Security Council

1. The Security Council represents the judicial system within the Internationale.
2. The Security Council is composed by the current forum administrator (Nero Superbus) and an undefined number of moderators.
3. The Security Council has the power to punish any member/institution of the Internationale if he is considered guilty of breaking the Law of Justice. (If the creation of the Security Council will be approved, we will send a Law of Justice to be approved too, Law of Justice = rights and rules for the members of the Internationale).
4. The Security Council amends members with the following punishments: tax pay, temporary ban, restriction from Congress, restriction from Security Council, restriction from certain Group, permanent ban.
5. The Security Council amends institutions of the Internationale with the following punishments: re-voting of a problem, disbanding the current mandates of persons inside the institution, reorganization proposal inside the Congress.
6. The Security Council has one Commissar, which is the representative of the SC in the Congress.
7. The Commissar is elected democratically for an undefined period, and can be dismissed by a majority vote of the members of the Security Council.
8. The Congress has the power to dismiss the Security Council if 2/3 of the total votes agree.
9. The Security Council is organized internally by its members.
10. Further internal organization of the Security Council will be referred in the rule-book of the SC, Regulation of the Security Council.

[Maksim Chuikov]

This council would effectively run the Internationale. This organization can't dictate to what degree a party can supervise their members, infact, it doesn't mention anything about party inner policies, but this organization must remain open.

If such an organization would exist, this security council should only have the rights to monitor and report every x-days about what's happening.

- M. Chuikov

[Describer]

Cant agree with point 2.

My version -

The Security Council is composed by the current forum administrator (Nero Superbus) and Congress members.

If its not possible,.then please explain how moderators will be elected.

[Draaglom]

I like the spirit, but couldn't you just have mod tryouts? :<

[Famzay]

Looks good to me, but not sure about part 6 and 7.

6. Does this person hold any executive power? How much stronger is he than the SC?
7. Why not have elections every 3 months or so? It will let others have a shot at the Commissar position without causing a revolt/overthrow which may hurt relations among members.

[Alkarin]

Looks very...USSR-esque to me

[Famzay]

Looks very...USSR-esque to me

Except for the Democracy bit

[Maksim Chuikov]

We need a security council, I've just been made aware of. However, this council must follow strict democratic guidelines.

Yes.

- M. Chuikov

[lxbrtldisaad]

Though this may seem a bit naive, and I must admit I am not a regular on the Internationale, this seems to me like a Committee of Public Safety, especially in the ability to denounce others.
Perhaps fitting with the forum's purpose, it should be renamed the Politburo or something of that strain.

[johnobrow]

No! No! No! No! No! And No! again.

[Bob the terrorist]

Whut?

[Alkarin]

Looks very...USSR-esque to me

Except for the Democracy bit

USSR was a republic

[lxbrtldisaad]

A democracy though?

[Fredrick Engels]

I don't think this is such a good idea, I could see this have a lot of potential for corruption and centralization of powers in the Internationale. It could effectively destroy dissent within the Internationale(Which is a good thing sometimes) and isolate individual parties forcing them to not want to be part of this organization. Also like Maksim said, we can't regulate what the people in our parties say or do, we are individuals here. There are of course cases like Celio where all he does is troll, call us fascists and opportunists, and tries to split up the Internationale. We have the good luck of Celio just trying to consolidate his own power and making up lies, and I think we're handling it well right now(although a proposal could have come up faster) without this security council.

If we really needed a "security council" then I think it should just have the powers to monitor and report people, after that congress would decide what to do with them. Even then I don't like the idea of monitoring people, and I definitely don't like the idea of taxing people as a punishment.

[Nero Superbus]

1. I really hate people who post no on this and don't explain why. At least prove your point. And if you want to help me, you should give also changes to the articles i proposed, apart from only saying that you don't like.

2. As i said, the SC has the power to punish members/institutions if the trials are proved that way. Let's say one comrade starts a trial against the Congress because the Congress voted to start an RW in his country without asking the communist party. We'll try to solve that problem and if the RW is proven to be illegal, we'll tell the Congress to review the decision immediately (maybe disbanding the members is a little to harsh). If the RW is proven to be legal, because the Internationale is here to spread communism and so on and so forth, accusations will be dropped. The thing is we need a judicial system.

3. This could lead to corruption, that's why i'm planning to have serious laws for moderators and other stuff. (moderators cannot be congressmen, severe punishments for breaking the Law of Justice or the Moderators' Laws).

4. Please if you don't like an article please do the changes necessary. I want to see your point of view too, not only that i made some articles wrong. I'm open to any changes as i really want this institution to be created and be effective.


@ Famzay: 6. The Comissar supervise the moderators in taking the actions good and giving the good punishments for the severity of the illegal act. It also has the same powers as the Comissar and is the legal representant of the SC in the Congress (he can propose stuff if he want about legal stuff etc. etc.). The moderators are chosen by vote of the SC. Also the Comissar coordinates the activity, such as the Chairman of the Congress. That's all.
7. Good idea, 3 months is a good term.

@Alkarin: it is necessary.
@lxbrtldisaad: I think the Politburo is something else and could cause confusions.
@Frederick Engels: i think the Congress has other more stuff to do than deciding to ban people. I proposed this institution because Celio should have been banned a while ago, and if we leave that to the congress it will take days, in which he could harm the forums.(what if one sits 12 hours in front of pc and spams the forums - will give moderators headaches).
@Maksim: I agree. We need a Security Council and as i said, i'm opened to proposals of articles of how should it be run and voting so that the SC would make an effective institution inside the Internationale.

We are growing in numbers, we are already about 150 members here. Without a judicial system in order, a good one, we won't be effective and spam, threads put in the wrong forum could slow down the processes of the Internationale. That is why, the SC must be created, to help the Internationale continue the revolutionary fighting without counter-revolutionary congress members showing around here.

I strongly suggest to all the Congress Comrades to think well about this, as we need an effective institution. Just don't drop all on the congress so solve it. The Congress leads the revolutionary fight. Let the Security Council take care of the internal business inside the Internationale. I promise you, i will supervise this carefully so that no individual/party would be left alone/misjudged/any potential harm against other members.

Aren't you tired of seeing disputes between members in every forum section? Like those with Mannimarco, Celio (disputes with him were almost in every forum). Aren't you aware that we have members that suggest coming to the new Internationale? That the new members could be disrupted by them, and lead to the false Internationale? That's why we need things to be clear. I will also propose to the Congress the Law of Justice (rights of comrades inside the Internationale and of institutions) so that every member will be protected by this law, in case one moderator/congressmember crosses the line. So that the SC will take an appropriate measure if someone denies the rights to someone else after a fair trial. Think about it...

[Describer]

Who and how will select these moderators?

[Maksim Chuikov]

1. If Congress members can't be moderators -- then who will be? Most of the "capable" persons are Congress members.

2. The Security Council shouldn't have a commissar, the lead institute of that council would be the Congress (let's not create a separate power entity in here).

3. The forum administrator is always given to the chairman of the Internationale. How about the chairman is given the password to the admin account, then once his reign is over he passes the passwords on to the new chairman?
b) We may need a safety plan, of some kind. If the chairman goes inactive or the password is lost -- we must have a way of retrieving it.

- M. Chuikov

[Nero Superbus]

1. ok, got a point, but we shouldn't restrict to only congressmembers.

2. I was thinking at the separation of powers. What if the Congress bypass the rights of comrades (maybe don't allow him to speak or other stuff)? If you start to think, the Congress can be biased.

3. It is more easier to pass on admin status. Osman has an admin status and can make the following chair admin too, and after that, the new chair would retrieve the admin status from Osman. This is a good system. And about the inactivity, i also have admin default powers so i can change that.(if i'm not on the forums, you can send me an e-mail to yahoo from my profile)

@Describer: the congress would approve the list.

[Maksim Chuikov]

1 & 3: All good, doesn't matter that much.

2: The Congress is the absolute power of the Internationale and if that's biased, the entire organization is biased. If we change this, we can aswell remove the Congress and rename the leadership into Politburo as comrade Lxbrtldisaad said. If we start making organizations to back-up our democracy, which our democracy can't control, then we're in a load of trouble.

I still stand by my comment, the Congress must be the absolute power in the Internationale, otherwise my vote is no.

- M. Chuikov

[Nero Superbus]

Ok so basically the law will be:

1. Security Council will be an institution composed by the moderators of the forum. SC is subordinated to the Congress.

2. Security Council can give whatever punishments the Congress may decide to enact against counter-revolutionaries who spam our forums.

3. Security Council can give temporary bans on people who cannot stop spamming for the duration the Congress decides punishing.

4. Any comrade can apply for moderators; the list has to be approved by the Congress, before the modders are made available.

5. There will be a separate SC forum, which will contain special rules for the moderators and for the users. Any problem related to moderation will be discussed there, and trials (if you think a moderator has done something bad, will also be discussed there.)

Can i start the voting thread? I need approval.

[Maksim Chuikov]

Looks good, although change one word in chapter 2: "Security Council can give whatever punishments the Congress may[...] to "Security Council is obliged to take any actions the Congress decides to enact" or something similiar.

- M. Chuikov

[.Ne0]

2. The Security Council is composed by the current forum administrator (Nero Superbus) and an undefined number of moderators.

Are the moderators appointed or elected ?

4. The Security Council amends members with the following punishments: tax pay, temporary ban, restriction from Congress, restriction from Security Council, restriction from certain Group, permanent ban.
5. The Security Council amends institutions of the Internationale with the following punishments: re-voting of a problem, disbanding the current mandates of persons inside the institution, reorganization proposal inside the Congress.

The power to permanently ban an individual, and the powers stated in #5 should belong exclusively to the congress.

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